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2024-09-14 17:34:47

118 vs 135 drill bit anglereddit

Well, I dug out the Enco Hot Deals catalog and took the plunge. I purchased the 29 piece US made, 135 degree cobalt set for $77.95. I'm looking forward to trying it out.

What factors drive the selection of the drill bit angle? I need to restock on bits and I've always just bought jobber TiN bits. Now, I'm doing some research and am wondering about the angle. The jobber bits have always worked just fine for me.

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Show Quoted Text So -- you opted to try both the new material and the new point angle at the same time. You should have a pretty near indestructible set of drill bits, especially for drilling in tough steels, with that combination. I would have considered it more interesting to try just the new material first. Then the new point angle -- and perhaps not a full fractional set for the first try. But you should get years of service out of that set. Are you using them in a hand drill, or a drill press, lathe, or other stationary power tool? I would have opted for the standard 118 degree point for hand held electric drills (drill motors) -- or even better split points, simply because the 135 degree takes a bit more force applied by the tool, and is easier to control in something like a drill press than with a hand-held drill motor. I probably would not have asked this if you had gotten a number size set or a letter size set, but fractional are more often used in the hand-held tools. Enjoy, DoN.

Second related question: are cobalt bits worth the additional cost over TiN for drilling mild steel and occasional tempered steel? I am not dealing with "ordnance"/extremely hard steels - mostly raw stock and various automotive-related parts.

As an example of how much of a help a split pont can be, I had to drill some pins *in place* on my garage door. One end of the pins held the rollers which traveled in the track, and the other end tended to sometimes move too far and drop out of one side of the stamped metal "bearing". With a 1/16" split point, I was able to start the hole, and drill through using a hand-held electric drill, no center punch, and no fixturing. The diameter of the shaft was 5/16" IIRC -- enough of a curve to make starting a normal drill bit more difficult.

Be aware that while the Drill Dr. claims to be able to produce split points, it seems to work only on larger drill bits -- while I often want them on smaller bits.

90 degree Angle Point Many soft and low-strength materials, such as some cast irons, aluminum, plastic, and wood can be drilled more efficiently with a reduced point angle. Although this change reduces the effective rake angle of the cutting edge (lip) and the length of the lip is increased, the driving torque required to drill these materials usually remains with acceptable limits. The reduced feed pressures and the increased lip relief angle frequently permit higher feed rates. To produce this point, simply set point angle at

Show Quoted Text Nice! Now if it were only cobalt steel, and split points at the same time, I would be really happy. Enjoy, DoN.

Show Quoted Text Aside from what has already been discussed, another factor is "split points". These offer some significant advantages. 1) They take less force to drill through a given material, because you are not having to force the "chisel edge" in the center of the point into the workpiece. (This is more of a problem with larger sizes, but can be a benefit for any size. 2) It is a lot easier to *start* a drill bit where you want it with a split point. Normally, you can use a center punch to produce a guide for the drill bit -- but in some materials (Titanium, and some stainless steels) the work hardening caused by the center punch can make it more difficult to start cutting, as the drill bit is having to deal with a hardened material. As an example of how much of a help a split pont can be, I had to drill some pins *in place* on my garage door. One end of the pins held the rollers which traveled in the track, and the other end tended to sometimes move too far and drop out of one side of the stamped metal "bearing". With a 1/16" split point, I was able to start the hole, and drill through using a hand-held electric drill, no center punch, and no fixturing. The diameter of the shaft was 5/16" IIRC -- enough of a curve to make starting a normal drill bit more difficult. Also -- another thing to consider is drill bit length. There are some times when you need a jobber length, and even some times when you need the aircraft drills (6" or 12" long), but for most things, you can use the "screw machine" length, which is shorter than the jobber length, and thus stiffer. I have several sets of standard HSS drill bits, but my favorite is an index of screw machine length cobalt drills with split points in the number (0-60) size range. Some of these days, I hope to get the same in fractional, letter size, and even metric. Of course, they are more expensive. This set I got when MSC was offering the set on sale -- in a HUOT index which was modified to hold the shorter bits properly. Good Luck, DoN.

Show Quoted Text O.K. Though remember that a split point is not the same thing as a 135 degree bit -- you can have 118 degree bits in split point format as well. Be aware that while the Drill Dr. claims to be able to produce split points, it seems to work only on larger drill bits -- while I often want them on smaller bits. I use the Drill Dr. on larger bits (greater than 1/4"), but I also have a drill bit sharpener for bits from 1/4" down to #70. This one was made by DuMore (the maker of toolpost grinders), but it is no longer made. All in all, it is a really neat design, and works quite well -- once you have all of the collets -- one per bit size. A pity that they were discontinued. (Though it, also, does not produce split points, it does do a much nicer job of sharpening the smaller bits. When you discover that it is time to replace a given drill bit which you use frequently, I suggest that you order a 10-pack (the normal minimum quantity) from MSC or somewhere else, in cobalt, and with a split point, and you will be amazed how much nicer it is. Good Luck, DoN.

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118 vs 135 drill bit anglefor woodworking

For the typical drill bits, it will work fine. It is just those with unusual twists which are a problem. (Also -- if you have any left-hand bits, they also will not work at all. And left-hand drill bits are particularly good for drilling out broken off screws, so I have a few.)

It does fine as long as you don't want split points on smaller drill bits. (And I'm not sure how it does on the tiny bits (e.g. 1/16" or perhaps a #33), but it does fine on larger bits, and I use it for anything above 1/4". (Sometimes the ponts look a little strange, but they work well, which is what matters.

The easiest way to see which size you need is to check the size of the screw or fastener. This will be easier still if you are buying new sets of screws and bits at the same time. Take a loose screw and compare it to the size of the bit you need to use, using the screw’s core rather than its flute. A bit that is very slightly smaller than the screw will ensure a proper fit. Choosing a bit that is too small means that the screw will get stuck so take care to choose carefully. For a fastener such as an anchor, you will need to use a bit that is the same size as the anchor’s body. The bit needs to be big enough to drill a hole into the wall, while still being small enough to easily insert the anchor by hand rather than using your drill. To measure the size, hole your drill next to the anchor and measure the distance from the bit to the end of the anchor.

Yeah, I took the plunge. I've been itching to try the cobalt drills but thought a set would be well over $100. As things dull, I definitely have a dollar incentive now to sharpen them. I looked at a Lisle sharpener for $995 and it sure made the Drill Doctor seem attractive at $125 plus the posts over the past year seemed generally favorable. I do very little drilling under 1/8" but do a fair number of 1/8", 3/16" and 1/4" sheet metal holes for rivets, welding, etc. I have packages of drill bits in those sizes plus step drills and a Roper Whitney Jr. punch. I tell you, I sure like the step drills & punch for sheet metal vs. twist bits.

O.K. Though remember that a split point is not the same thing as a 135 degree bit -- you can have 118 degree bits in split point format as well.

I do both handheld and drill press. I didn't mention it, but I bought one of their cheap 135 degree HSS import sets for $14.95 for situations where I'm pretty sure the bit will be at risk due to the angle or situation in general. It was $9.95 for the 118 degree so I spent the extra money. There sure have been times I wishes the bits would enter the work easier.

George, The Cobalt bits are Much better than HSS in both wear and heat resistance. Often a requirement for stainless steel. Tin bits are simply coated like Titanium bits. In both cases the coating allows the chips to leave the drill bit without creating as much friction and thereby allowing the bit to remain cooler and last longer. Steve

118 vs 135 drill bit anglefor metal

Also -- another thing to consider is drill bit length. There are some times when you need a jobber length, and even some times when you need the aircraft drills (6" or 12" long), but for most things, you can use the "screw machine" length, which is shorter than the jobber length, and thus stiffer.

Don, one of these day's, I'll order in a few 135s and try them. Right now, I need to get in a new set and a sharpener (Drill Dr. 750).

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That you Steve. I'm going to way off the costs and decide what to buy this week. I'm sure inclined to try the cobalt bits - right now the decision is heavily weighted towards cost.

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Are you using them in a hand drill, or a drill press, lathe, or other stationary power tool? I would have opted for the standard 118 degree point for hand held electric drills (drill motors) -- or even better split points, simply because the 135 degree takes a bit more force applied by the tool, and is easier to control in something like a drill press than with a hand-held drill motor.

The biggest problem with guesstimating the size you will need is that you cannot be 100% sure that you have the right size bit. Accuracy is everything with any type of drilling, whether it is small DIY jobs around the house or larger renovation projects. To make sure you always get the right size drill bit for the job at hand, we’ve put together a few tips.

Whydrill bit angleis118

So -- you opted to try both the new material and the new point angle at the same time. You should have a pretty near indestructible set of drill bits, especially for drilling in tough steels, with that combination.

118 vs 135 drill bit anglefor steel

It can also be useful to make test holes to match up screws and bits to get your sizing right. This is helpful for future sizing as well. Use a thin piece of sheet metal and make a hole through the material using the bit you aim to use. You can then place your screws into the hole until you find one that fits properly. You can also keep this sheet somewhere safe to test sizes for other projects down the line. This is a good option if you have a lot of loose bits and screws and can’t remember their sizes.

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This tool is a must-have for your toolbox, giving you a high level of accuracy when measuring screws, bits and the dimension of any object. Using this tool will give you a precise measurement of the screw and the bit, making it easy to match with precision. They come in two forms - standard and digital. With two jaws at the top, the bottom jaw slides up and down to measure the dimension of the screw. Place the body of the screw between the jaws and then push the jaws shut with your fingers. Make sure that you don’t measure the head of the screw as this will give you an inaccurate measurement. Once the jaws are in place, you will get a measurement in millimetres. Digital callipers make things even simpler, giving you a reading on a digital screen. From there, you can match your screws and bits.

An adjustable wrench will make things easier. If you are trying to figure out the size of your bit to choose screws to match, you can do so with a wrench. Hold the bit you plan to use and carefully close the wrench until the jaws on either side where the numbers of the bit are printed. When they stop touching, you will have an accurate idea of size. This method is also a great option if you have a selection of bits in your toolbox and aren’t sure of the size. Once you’ve measured your bit, you can easily measure your screws.

I probably would not have asked this if you had gotten a number size set or a letter size set, but fractional are more often used in the hand-held tools.

Finally, it is always a good idea to invest in a set of bits. Most sets include standard sizes as well as larger or smaller sizes. Depending on the bit you are using, the size of the hole you need to make and the screws or fasteners you need to add, a set will give you more room to test sizes without having to go back and forth to your hardware store. Reading selection charts on bits and screws is also essential.

Wondering how to measure drill bit size? As far as drilling is concerned, having the right size bits is essential. If you’re planning a DIY project that involves bits and screws, you will need to get as accurate as possible. Using bits that are too small can result in a cracked or damaged workpiece, stuck bits or screws and even a damaged drill if you try and force a screw into a hole that does not fit the screw you are driving to drive into your workpiece. On the other hand, a bit that is too large means that you will have to change the size of your screws, which can affect the measurements of your entire project.

Of course, they are more expensive. This set I got when MSC was offering the set on sale -- in a HUOT index which was modified to hold the shorter bits properly.

135degree split pointdrill bit

Thank you Robert. I'm going to assume that the 118 degree bits must be a compromise between the two angles you mentioned. I notice the

Show Quoted Text It does fine as long as you don't want split points on smaller drill bits. (And I'm not sure how it does on the tiny bits (e.g. 1/16" or perhaps a #33), but it does fine on larger bits, and I use it for anything above 1/4". (Sometimes the ponts look a little strange, but they work well, which is what matters. However -- one thing that I have read can be a problem. It will *not* work (using the fixture which sets the angle of the bit on initial clamping into the collet) if you have a drill bit with an unusual spiral (either high-spiral or lo-spiral), because the fixture is setting things based on a point some distance back from the actual tip. There are ways to fake it, but the proper setting points are nor marked. For the typical drill bits, it will work fine. It is just those with unusual twists which are a problem. (Also -- if you have any left-hand bits, they also will not work at all. And left-hand drill bits are particularly good for drilling out broken off screws, so I have a few.) Good Luck, DoN.

When you discover that it is time to replace a given drill bit which you use frequently, I suggest that you order a 10-pack (the normal minimum quantity) from MSC or somewhere else, in cobalt, and with a split point, and you will be amazed how much nicer it is.

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Don, can you clarify what a split point bit is? At first I thought it was related to the angle and since this thread started I've inferred from some of the posts that it is not.

I would have considered it more interesting to try just the new material first. Then the new point angle -- and perhaps not a full fractional set for the first try. But you should get years of service out of that set.

George, No. No compronise - 118 deg. bits are, by far the most common. Darex only mentioned 135 deg. because their equipment can sharpen that angle which is a little better for harder material. IMO, you can probably do just as good a job in harder material with 118 deg. bits, if you are extra careful -- and if the bits are quality; which is more important than the point angle. Personally, I never use anything other than 118 deg.even though I have the equipment to grind 135 deg. points.

I have several sets of standard HSS drill bits, but my favorite is an index of screw machine length cobalt drills with split points in the number (0-60) size range. Some of these days, I hope to get the same in fractional, letter size, and even metric.

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Don, I've always wanted to sharpen my old bits because I feel guilty and pitching otherwise good bits. I'm basically a do-it-yourselfer who enjoys metalworking, fixing cars, etc. Thus, I tend to be a fairly basic drill bit user.

With a huge variety of bits for every material and project, Ruwag has all the drill bits you need in one place, making it as easy as possible to get your project underway.

I've heard others say the Drill Doctor 750 did fine by them & am going off that - I've never used one. Would you recommend it to a basic user such as myself?

I use the Drill Dr. on larger bits (greater than 1/4"), but I also have a drill bit sharpener for bits from 1/4" down to #70. This one was made by DuMore (the maker of toolpost grinders), but it is no longer made. All in all, it is a really neat design, and works quite well -- once you have all of the collets -- one per bit size. A pity that they were discontinued. (Though it, also, does not produce split points, it does do a much nicer job of sharpening the smaller bits.